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	<title>Comments on: Tour A Bohra</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/</link>
	<description>groundviews is an award winning Sri Lankan citizen journalism initiative</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 07 Oct 2008 23:15:27 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: ll</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-3390</link>
		<dc:creator>ll</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 Aug 2008 18:46:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-3390</guid>
		<description>I live here in Pakistan and i can tell you from personal experience that non-bohras are not allowed into the bohra masjid, the examples that are given above are of ministers and other people of influence visiting. Normal people like me aren't allowed in.
Yes i know that many of the other sects here also have issues with followers of other faiths entering their mosques but still doesn't make it right.

Another thing (and this really hurts cause it was personal) is that the bohras don't marry outside, there are an increasing number of outside the community marriages but they still face tremendous opposition from the family and most all the community (four people i know married outside so i know what they have to go through).
Now why do i know so many people like that and why'd i try to go into the bohra places? Well it's cause i love this girl and really want to marry her but la de dah she's a bohri and her daddy is like hitler reborn. I have nothing against the bohri people, I'm completely secular and open minded and so it really hurts when i'm faced with stuff like this. 
~:[  

oh and I'm pretty ok in every aspect, my being a sunni the only hitch (preemptive strike against any "maybe it's cause you're ugly!" comment)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I live here in Pakistan and i can tell you from personal experience that non-bohras are not allowed into the bohra masjid, the examples that are given above are of ministers and other people of influence visiting. Normal people like me aren&#8217;t allowed in.<br />
Yes i know that many of the other sects here also have issues with followers of other faiths entering their mosques but still doesn&#8217;t make it right.</p>
<p>Another thing (and this really hurts cause it was personal) is that the bohras don&#8217;t marry outside, there are an increasing number of outside the community marriages but they still face tremendous opposition from the family and most all the community (four people i know married outside so i know what they have to go through).<br />
Now why do i know so many people like that and why&#8217;d i try to go into the bohra places? Well it&#8217;s cause i love this girl and really want to marry her but la de dah she&#8217;s a bohri and her daddy is like hitler reborn. I have nothing against the bohri people, I&#8217;m completely secular and open minded and so it really hurts when i&#8217;m faced with stuff like this.<br />
~:[  </p>
<p>oh and I&#8217;m pretty ok in every aspect, my being a sunni the only hitch (preemptive strike against any &#8220;maybe it&#8217;s cause you&#8217;re ugly!&#8221; comment)</p>
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		<title>By: Mu'min</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-499</link>
		<dc:creator>Mu'min</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 11:57:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-499</guid>
		<description>A very interesting discussion hereâ¦ Iâm quite impressed with Sri Lankans, pretty much in the same way as Lankans are with Bohras. The emotions on this page are quite colorful â certainly good reading material.

But Wikipedia is not your best source for information, dear indi. Convenient and quick, but not comprehensive. The truth is a lot simpler and a whole lot more complex.

Anyway, if you must know, Dawoodi Bohras that subject themselves to the authority of our spiritual leader have no doubt in their minds that they practice the true religion of God, which we believe is Islam, carefully handed down from the last Prophet Muhammad (SAW) to his true inheritors.

We are thankful to be a part of this community, as we have the best of both worlds â in more ways than can be easily understood by anyone.

Unfortunately, us humans do not easily accept the ways of divinity. For this reason there have always been enemies of Islam. And the worst enemies are those that use the name of Islam itself to wreak havoc and shroud the beauty of Islam.

It is no wonder that those with malice in their heart are naturally repelled by spirituality and piety, while those that God has chosen to have love in their hearts are attracted to it.

Dear indi, a Bohra is a far cry from what you get from a Wiki - or a mountain in Afghanistan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A very interesting discussion hereâ¦ Iâm quite impressed with Sri Lankans, pretty much in the same way as Lankans are with Bohras. The emotions on this page are quite colorful â certainly good reading material.</p>
<p>But Wikipedia is not your best source for information, dear indi. Convenient and quick, but not comprehensive. The truth is a lot simpler and a whole lot more complex.</p>
<p>Anyway, if you must know, Dawoodi Bohras that subject themselves to the authority of our spiritual leader have no doubt in their minds that they practice the true religion of God, which we believe is Islam, carefully handed down from the last Prophet Muhammad (SAW) to his true inheritors.</p>
<p>We are thankful to be a part of this community, as we have the best of both worlds â in more ways than can be easily understood by anyone.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, us humans do not easily accept the ways of divinity. For this reason there have always been enemies of Islam. And the worst enemies are those that use the name of Islam itself to wreak havoc and shroud the beauty of Islam.</p>
<p>It is no wonder that those with malice in their heart are naturally repelled by spirituality and piety, while those that God has chosen to have love in their hearts are attracted to it.</p>
<p>Dear indi, a Bohra is a far cry from what you get from a Wiki - or a mountain in Afghanistan.</p>
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		<title>By: Mustafa UK</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-498</link>
		<dc:creator>Mustafa UK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 Jun 2007 18:18:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-498</guid>
		<description>The reason we carry ID cards is to help us find our alotted accomodation especially in Sri Lanka where at the time there was a shortage of accomodation.
It is the belief of our leader that nobody should be without accomodation or food. That nobody should sleep homeless. So it is for our convience not for oppression as was done to the jews.

Secondly it is not true that other muslims our not allowed into our masjids. Anyone can pray there and at Friday prays or in the month of Ramadan we have muslims from other communities in our Masjid in London UK. Also we have visiters such as politians visit us well. We are well intergrated and part of any community we live in anywhere in the world. It is also a lie that the buildings have to be washed if another muslim enters and this rumour was proberly made up by dissidents who are trying to harm the community from within or the Wahhabis who are hate all muslims who are not extremists like themselves.

Lastly we believe in the Prophet Mohammed like everyone else in fact we hold him in higher respect than some other muslims like sulafids  and we are not allowed to be engaged at birth as a person isnt born into the faith they must choose at puberty to join or leave and they must choose who they marry. When a Bohra gets married they are asked multiple time if they want to get married as forced marriages are not allowed and this rule is strictly enforced.

All the holy sites in Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Yemen and Iraq are mantained by us and we are currently restoring the holy sites in Iraq. Kerbala, Najaf and Kufa. We own schools and hospitals around the world and run the Saifee ambulance service in Mumbai as well having built the Saifee hospital in India. The tallest building in that area of asia.

The 51st Dai helped pay for the rebuilng of  the Kaba in Mecca and made the curtains used inside his name Syedna Taher Saifuddin is also engraved in the Al Aqsa masjid in jerusalam as he had paid for its renovation. He was close friends with Mathama Ghandi along with the present 52nd Dai al  Mutlaq and the road used in the salt march against the British empire has been named after him as Ghandi stayed in his house afterwards.

The 52nd Dai Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin is a ambassador of peace and goodwill for the United Nations and been given awards from around the world and the British Parliment have said that the celebration of his birthday will be a annual event in the houses of parliament. The mother of democracy.

There is more I could say but I would like to remind people that the internet is a place where stories and rumours and lies are spread and when bad things are said about people we should ask is this realistic and why it is the person is saying it. The bohra community is no different to any community and we have storys made up about us just like anyone else. People should ask themselves how they would feel if bad thing were being said about them and should look at how we peacefully and patiently live with these lies.  We are the only community in the world to have institutionally provided interest free loans and succesfully removed absolute poverty from our community with it. We have 100% litracy rates and in the words of the prime minister Tony Blair "Young muslims are tired of how a small number of vocal extremists hide the voice of true muslims and constantly get media coverage". This is how we feel about the minority from within our own community who give a bad name by constanly crying wolf and those from sunni muslims who keep making up stories about how we dont believe in Islamic concepts such as we believe in reincarnation or we dont pray correctly. If this was true than why our we allowed to go on the hajj when other groups like the nizari khojas have been banned.They also say things about corruption in community finances but they do not realise that we do not recieve money from the saudi arabian goverment like other muslims and we have expensives costs such as the upkeep of pilgrim houses or food for visitors to our masjids that is why money is collected centrally by one source. This is the easiest method of distribution and everyone is happy with it. These are lies knowingly created by people who are tageting a peaceful community.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The reason we carry ID cards is to help us find our alotted accomodation especially in Sri Lanka where at the time there was a shortage of accomodation.<br />
It is the belief of our leader that nobody should be without accomodation or food. That nobody should sleep homeless. So it is for our convience not for oppression as was done to the jews.</p>
<p>Secondly it is not true that other muslims our not allowed into our masjids. Anyone can pray there and at Friday prays or in the month of Ramadan we have muslims from other communities in our Masjid in London UK. Also we have visiters such as politians visit us well. We are well intergrated and part of any community we live in anywhere in the world. It is also a lie that the buildings have to be washed if another muslim enters and this rumour was proberly made up by dissidents who are trying to harm the community from within or the Wahhabis who are hate all muslims who are not extremists like themselves.</p>
<p>Lastly we believe in the Prophet Mohammed like everyone else in fact we hold him in higher respect than some other muslims like sulafids  and we are not allowed to be engaged at birth as a person isnt born into the faith they must choose at puberty to join or leave and they must choose who they marry. When a Bohra gets married they are asked multiple time if they want to get married as forced marriages are not allowed and this rule is strictly enforced.</p>
<p>All the holy sites in Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Yemen and Iraq are mantained by us and we are currently restoring the holy sites in Iraq. Kerbala, Najaf and Kufa. We own schools and hospitals around the world and run the Saifee ambulance service in Mumbai as well having built the Saifee hospital in India. The tallest building in that area of asia.</p>
<p>The 51st Dai helped pay for the rebuilng of  the Kaba in Mecca and made the curtains used inside his name Syedna Taher Saifuddin is also engraved in the Al Aqsa masjid in jerusalam as he had paid for its renovation. He was close friends with Mathama Ghandi along with the present 52nd Dai al  Mutlaq and the road used in the salt march against the British empire has been named after him as Ghandi stayed in his house afterwards.</p>
<p>The 52nd Dai Syedna Mohammed Burhanuddin is a ambassador of peace and goodwill for the United Nations and been given awards from around the world and the British Parliment have said that the celebration of his birthday will be a annual event in the houses of parliament. The mother of democracy.</p>
<p>There is more I could say but I would like to remind people that the internet is a place where stories and rumours and lies are spread and when bad things are said about people we should ask is this realistic and why it is the person is saying it. The bohra community is no different to any community and we have storys made up about us just like anyone else. People should ask themselves how they would feel if bad thing were being said about them and should look at how we peacefully and patiently live with these lies.  We are the only community in the world to have institutionally provided interest free loans and succesfully removed absolute poverty from our community with it. We have 100% litracy rates and in the words of the prime minister Tony Blair &#8220;Young muslims are tired of how a small number of vocal extremists hide the voice of true muslims and constantly get media coverage&#8221;. This is how we feel about the minority from within our own community who give a bad name by constanly crying wolf and those from sunni muslims who keep making up stories about how we dont believe in Islamic concepts such as we believe in reincarnation or we dont pray correctly. If this was true than why our we allowed to go on the hajj when other groups like the nizari khojas have been banned.They also say things about corruption in community finances but they do not realise that we do not recieve money from the saudi arabian goverment like other muslims and we have expensives costs such as the upkeep of pilgrim houses or food for visitors to our masjids that is why money is collected centrally by one source. This is the easiest method of distribution and everyone is happy with it. These are lies knowingly created by people who are tageting a peaceful community.</p>
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		<title>By: groundviews</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-497</link>
		<dc:creator>groundviews</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Feb 2007 09:45:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-497</guid>
		<description>Interesting debate on multiculturalism within a British context here - http://www.madrid11.net/article/ukmuslims070207</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting debate on multiculturalism within a British context here - <a href="http://www.madrid11.net/article/ukmuslims070207" rel="nofollow">http://www.madrid11.net/article/ukmuslims070207</a></p>
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		<title>By: murtaza</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-496</link>
		<dc:creator>murtaza</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Feb 2007 09:31:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-496</guid>
		<description>And the card that was scanned at the airport was an e-card that contains all our details. Every Bohra member has this e-card. All the activities regarding travelling, accomodation, seating allocation in the mosque and food are allotted via this card.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And the card that was scanned at the airport was an e-card that contains all our details. Every Bohra member has this e-card. All the activities regarding travelling, accomodation, seating allocation in the mosque and food are allotted via this card.</p>
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		<title>By: murtaza</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-495</link>
		<dc:creator>murtaza</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Feb 2007 09:26:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-495</guid>
		<description>I am a Bohra from Bangalore. After reading all the posts, I didn't find anything racist here, though there were certainly somethings which were not correct due to ignorance.

The comment about us not accepting Prophet Muhammad as a Prohet is absolutely wrong. Infact, during the Ashara Mubaraka observed in Colombo a major part of the prayers were devoted to the Prohepts sayings.

Many Bohras in Colombo, and indeed elsewhere, are rich and do pay a large sum as tax to the community but is there anything wrong.

The Bohras are very secular. The point about non-bohras cannot worship in our mosques is to some extent true, but it is vice versa. The major reason being our prayers are quite different from the other Muslim sects. But in this era of peaceful co-existence this should not be an issue. Infact in a previous Ashara Mubarak, in Mumbai, we had the chief-minister of Mumbai and other ministers visiting the mosque during prayers to greet His Holiness, and the mosque was certainly not washed after their departure as someone claims.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a Bohra from Bangalore. After reading all the posts, I didn&#8217;t find anything racist here, though there were certainly somethings which were not correct due to ignorance.</p>
<p>The comment about us not accepting Prophet Muhammad as a Prohet is absolutely wrong. Infact, during the Ashara Mubaraka observed in Colombo a major part of the prayers were devoted to the Prohepts sayings.</p>
<p>Many Bohras in Colombo, and indeed elsewhere, are rich and do pay a large sum as tax to the community but is there anything wrong.</p>
<p>The Bohras are very secular. The point about non-bohras cannot worship in our mosques is to some extent true, but it is vice versa. The major reason being our prayers are quite different from the other Muslim sects. But in this era of peaceful co-existence this should not be an issue. Infact in a previous Ashara Mubarak, in Mumbai, we had the chief-minister of Mumbai and other ministers visiting the mosque during prayers to greet His Holiness, and the mosque was certainly not washed after their departure as someone claims.</p>
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		<title>By: groundviews</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-494</link>
		<dc:creator>groundviews</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Feb 2007 04:59:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-494</guid>
		<description>An interesting post in light of the discussions here - http://www.madrid11.net/forum/multiculturalism300107</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An interesting post in light of the discussions here - <a href="http://www.madrid11.net/forum/multiculturalism300107" rel="nofollow">http://www.madrid11.net/forum/multiculturalism300107</a></p>
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		<title>By: indi</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-493</link>
		<dc:creator>indi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 10:33:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-493</guid>
		<description>Fair enough</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fair enough</p>
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		<title>By: Asanga Welikala</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-492</link>
		<dc:creator>Asanga Welikala</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 09:58:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-492</guid>
		<description>Thank you Indi. If you noted in my comment, I was very clear that I was not imputing a particular motive, and certainly did not call your post racist. And I admit that the reference to the Jewish exprience was perhaps disproportionate.

However, the larger point about 'difference' in a pluralist context I make remains valid, and if the recent rows (serious) about veil wearing by Muslim women in France and UK, and (less serious) the UK Channel 4 Celebrity Big Brother controversy shows, these are problems facing any society, not just ours.

This seems also the point that JustMal makes, when he says I am talking about a "non-existent, secular, pluralist utopia." That does not however mean that we should lose sight of ideals, nor that the only questions we ask have to be those based on 'realism' or 'reality' however unpleasant or unacceptable that may be.

Finally, I am entirely with you on the corrosive effect of political correctness - it tends to discourage enquiry and understanding. You would, I hope, in turn concede that the questions I ask are equally valid ones in such a enquiry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you Indi. If you noted in my comment, I was very clear that I was not imputing a particular motive, and certainly did not call your post racist. And I admit that the reference to the Jewish exprience was perhaps disproportionate.</p>
<p>However, the larger point about &#8216;difference&#8217; in a pluralist context I make remains valid, and if the recent rows (serious) about veil wearing by Muslim women in France and UK, and (less serious) the UK Channel 4 Celebrity Big Brother controversy shows, these are problems facing any society, not just ours.</p>
<p>This seems also the point that JustMal makes, when he says I am talking about a &#8220;non-existent, secular, pluralist utopia.&#8221; That does not however mean that we should lose sight of ideals, nor that the only questions we ask have to be those based on &#8216;realism&#8217; or &#8216;reality&#8217; however unpleasant or unacceptable that may be.</p>
<p>Finally, I am entirely with you on the corrosive effect of political correctness - it tends to discourage enquiry and understanding. You would, I hope, in turn concede that the questions I ask are equally valid ones in such a enquiry.</p>
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		<title>By: indi</title>
		<link>http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-491</link>
		<dc:creator>indi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 06:01:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.groundviews.org/2007/01/31/tour-a-bohra/#comment-491</guid>
		<description>I don't think this post was racist, and the comparison to Nazi's is spurious at best. I tried to be respectful to Bohras at all times, and everything can be pretty directly sourced to Wikipedia (as per the internal links). It actually turns out that I know a few Sri Lankan Bohras (and didn't know that about them). I did refer to them as guests, but most of the pilgrims we see are just that, pilgrims from India. If anything the post was an attempt to understand them better. Saying that they're involved in business and have some especially wealthy followers in SL isn't offensive, it's just a facet of that culture.

The enduring challenge of multi-culturalism isn't being politically correct all the time, it's attempting to learn about and understand one another.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think this post was racist, and the comparison to Nazi&#8217;s is spurious at best. I tried to be respectful to Bohras at all times, and everything can be pretty directly sourced to Wikipedia (as per the internal links). It actually turns out that I know a few Sri Lankan Bohras (and didn&#8217;t know that about them). I did refer to them as guests, but most of the pilgrims we see are just that, pilgrims from India. If anything the post was an attempt to understand them better. Saying that they&#8217;re involved in business and have some especially wealthy followers in SL isn&#8217;t offensive, it&#8217;s just a facet of that culture.</p>
<p>The enduring challenge of multi-culturalism isn&#8217;t being politically correct all the time, it&#8217;s attempting to learn about and understand one another.</p>
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